Sunday, June 8, 2014

Overview on ROKN's Pohang-class Corvettes, and Transfer of 1 ship to the PN

Aside from the earlier report of a scheduled transfer of a Landing Craft - Utility (LCU) and rubber boats from South Korea to the Philippine Navy, MaxDefense also confirm reports that surfaced on June 5, 2014 that the South Korean Ministry of Defense will transfer a Pohang-class corvette to the Philippine Navy before the end of 2014. The Philippines' Department Foreign Affairs (DFA) confirmed the impending transfer in their released official statement dated June 5, 2014, while the Department of National Defense (DND) through its representative  Mr. Peter Paul Galvez confirmed the transfer as well.

What is still being confirmed as of this writing is the version of the Pohang-class corvette to be given to the Philippine Navy (PN). There are currently 3 sub-classes for the entire class range, having different and improving configuration as the class matures. Also being confirmed are the included sensors and weapons system in the transfer. 


The South Korean government has approved handing-over a Pohang-class corvette to the Philippine Navy. Above is ROKS Gunsan (PCC-757).
Photo taken from Koreadefense.net.



Understanding the Korean Naval Shipbuilding in the 1980s:
The late 1970s and early 1980s saw the massive industrialization efforts of South Korea gaining ground, backed by fast expanding economy and government support for self sufficiency. The ROKN embarked on a massive shipbuilding program to prove their gains and experience from the local manufacture of their earlier Chamsuri-class patrol boat (Tomas Batillo-class in the PN) in the 1970s.  This led to the Fast Frigate Korea (FFK) and Patrol Combat Corvette (PCC) projects, which ultimately became the Ulsan-class frigate based on the HDF-2000 design, and Donghae-class corvettes(PCC Flight I) based on HDC-8000 design. The first ship of the Donghae-class, the ROKS Donghae (PCC-751) was commissioned to the ROKN in 1983, but according to Korean sources, the design encountered sea-keeping issues on the open seas due to the hull's small size, and it ROKN requested for a re-design of the PCC program using an enlarged version of the HDC-8000 design, and decided to end the production of the Donghae-class corvette at 4 units. The resulting design, the HDC-1200, which became a class of its own despite huge similarities with the earlier Donghae-class design. This design ultimately became the ROKN's Pohang-class corvette (PCC Flight II). 

Compared to the older Donghae-class, the Pohang-class is 10 meters longer, and around 0.3 meters wider and deeper. This resulted to better sea-keeping attributes on open seas, and ROKN decided to continue the PCC program using the design. Improvements on machinery, habitability, weapons and sensors fit were also made to maximize the usage of the hull enlargement.

Note: A derivative design based on the Donghae and Pohang-class ships was made for the Korean Maritime Police (Coast Guard), called the Hankang-class, which is lightly armed and less capable than its naval counterparts.


The ROKS Suwon (PCC-752), the 2nd ship of the Donghae-class corvettes.



The Pohang-class corvette:
The Republic of Korea Navy (ROKN) operated a maximum of 24 locally-made Pohang-class "combat corvettes", of which 21 are still in active service as of June 2014. Being a derivative of the Donghae-class, the Pohang-class provided increased size and improved performance, and improvements on sensors and weapons systems fit including accommodation for anti-ship missile systems.  The lead ship of the class, ROKS Pohang (PCC-756), was commissioned to the ROKN on December 1984, while the last unit, ROKS Gongju (PCC-785), was commissioned on July 1993. Construction for the ship class was divided to 3 of South Korea's foremost naval shipbuilders in the 1980s, Korea Tacoma Shipbuilding (now Hanjin Heavy Industries), Hyundai Heavy Industries, and Daewoo Shipbuilding & Marine Engineering.

Note: Hyundai Heavy Industries and Daewoo Shipbuilding and Marine Engineering are both contenders for the upcoming new frigates for the Philippine Navy.

The class have the following details technical details:
Dimensions (length x beam x depth): 88.3m x 10.0m x 2.9m;
Displacement: 1,220 tons at full load;
Speed: 32 knots maximum using gas turbine;
Range: 4,000 miles at 15 knots
Crew: 95 

The Pohang-class is divided into 3 sub-classes, each being an improvement over the other:

PCC Pohang-subclass (PCC Flight II)
This is the so-called surface warfare version (ASuW), originally conceived as the only version with anti-ship missiles. The sub-class covering 4 ships (PCC-756 to PCC-759). These are equipped with: 
- 1 x GE LM-2500 gas turbine, 2 x MTU 12V956 TB82 diesel engines at CODOG configuaration;
- Raytheon AN/SPS-64(v) surface search/navigation radar, Signaal WM-28 Fire Control System, Signaal LIOD optronic director, Signaal Sewaco ZK combat data system;
- 1 x Oto Melara 76mm/62 Compact gun, 2 x MM38 Exocet anti-ship missile launchers, 2 x Emerlec Twin 30mm guns, 2 x triple Mk. 32 324mm ASW torpedo tubes, 2 x Mk.9 Depth Charge racks.


The ROKS Mokpo (PCC-759), the last ship of the ASW sub-class.


PCC Gimcheon-subclass (PCC Flight III)
This is the anti-submarine warfare (ASW) version, covering 4 ships (PCC-761 to PCC-765, skipped PCC-764). Changes on the combat data system and secondary guns, and addition of another 76mm gun plus a hull-mounted sonar system, and absence of anti-ship missile system as compared to the earlier sub-class.
- 1 x GE LM-2500 gas turbine, 2 x MTU 12V956 TB82 diesel engines at CODOG configuration;
- Raytheon AN/SPS-64(v) surface search/navigation radar, Signaal WM-28 Fire Control system, Signaal LIOD optronic director, Raytheon AN/SQS-58 hull mounted sonar replacing the original Signaal PHS-32, Ferranti WSA 423 combat data system;
- 2 x Oto Melara 76mm/62 Compact gun, 2 x Breda twin 40mm/70 guns, 2 x triple Mk. 32 324mm ASW torpedo tubes, 2 x Mk.9 Depth Charge racks, 1 x Mistral / Chiron MANPADS launcher added later on.


The ROKS Gimcheon (PCC-761), part of the ASW sub-class.


PCC Jinhae-subclass (PCC Flight IV & V)
This is an improved re-design that incorporates the ASW and ASuW capabilities, unlike the earlier 2 sub-classes. The use of space-saving Harpoon tube launchers instead of the older MM38 Exocet boxed launchers enabled the ship to carry more missiles while also having the ASW capability. The diesel engine was also changed from MTU to SEMT-Pielstick brand. This sub-class covers 16 ships (PCC-766 to PCC-784, skipping PCC-770, 774, 780 and 784). PCC Flight V started from PCC-778, the difference being the Marconi and Radamec sensors system installed are licensed-built versions from Samsung.
- 1 x GE LM-2500 gas turbine, 2 x SEMT-Pielstick 12 PA6 V280 diesel engines at CODOG configuration;
- Marconi ST1810 surface search/navigation radar, Marconi ST1802 fire control radar, 2 x Radamec 2400 optronic system, Raytheon AN/SQS-58 hull mounted sonar replacing the original Signaal PHS-32, Ferranti WSA 423 combat data system;
- 2 x Oto Melara 76mm/62 Compact gun, 2 x Breda twin 40mm/70 guns, 2 x twin RGM-84 Harpoon anti-ship missile launchers; 2 x triple Mk. 32 324mm ASW torpedo tubes, 2 x Mk. 9 Depth Charge racks, 1 x Mistral / Chiron MANPADS launcher added later on.


The ROKS Wonju (PCC-769), a ship classified under the Jinhae-subclass.


So far, 3 Pohang-class ships are out of service as of June 2014: ROKS Pohang (PCC-756) was decommissioned from the ROKN in 2009 and was turned to a museum ship in Pohang City, ROKS Gunsan (PCC-757) was decommissioned in 2011 and is awaiting decision on its fate after an offer to transfer the ship to the Colombian Navy did not push through. The most famous ship of the class, the ROKS Cheonan (PCC-772), was sunk in 2010.



Transfer to the Philippine Navy:
There is no definite information yet on which ship will be for transfer. According to the DFA and DND announcements, the specific ship for the PN is still in active service with the ROKN as of this writing. Usually a navy selects the older and worse-condition ship of the class for decommissioning ships, so the most expected ship that fits this bill would be either of the 2 remaining ASuW versions, the ROKS Gyeongju (PCC-758) and the ROKS Mokpo (PCC-759). It is to be noted that ROKS Gunsan (PCC-757) was already decommissioned from the ROKN since 2011, so it may not fit the description. The PN would be lucky if they receive a more capable version.

The expected transfer date is before the end of the year, and previous announcements indicated that ship's systems would be intact upon transfer unlike what the PN experienced with the Hamilton-class cutters from the US. There are confirmations from MaxDefense sources that the ship could be "almost entirely intact as it is depending on approval from foreign governments holding rights to approval of arms transfers", and if these approvals are met, we can expect the ship to be in the Philippines before the end of the year.



New systems for the PN:
A small ship in the eyes of many, it packs several naval systems that are currently not available with the PN. Assuming that the PN will get the earlier ASuW version, the following are expected to give the PN the technology and knowledge boost it needs:


There are several systems in the ship that is not available in the PN's inventory or knowledge base. This small ship surely is helpful to the PN's goal to improve its capability. 


1. It uses the GE LM-2500 gas turbine engine - although the PN is not a stranger to naval application of gas turbines thanks to the Gregorio del Pilar-class frigates, the LM-2500 is somehing new to them. It is much modern, more powerful, and is one of the most widely used gas turbine engine for warship application in the world.

2. Presence of ASW weapons - the ship is equipped with ASW torpedo launchers and depth charge racks - weapons that the PN have not used since the early 1980s. This would re-introduce the organization to such weapons which are expected to be present in upcoming warships.

3. The anti-ship missile system - the PN has never equipped its ships with anti-ship missiles in the past, although it has been planning to do so since the 1970s. Although the ship's MM-38 Exocet missile is already nearing obsolescence, it could still be a good training and learning platform for the PN while waiting for plans to introduce newer systems.

4. Warship design that is younger than all its major surface action assets - it should be taken into consideration that the Pohang-class' design is far younger than the PN's World War 2-era warships, its Gregorio del Pilar-class frigates, and even its British made Jacinto-class ships. MaxDefense is not familiar with the Pohang-class' advantages in warship hull design, but it is expected to benefit from maturity of technology over older designs. This could provide the information and technology base for the PN's future ship design and building programs under the Naval Research and Development Center's (NRDC) project.


What the PN should be doing by now:
Being a warship with more capable systems than the Gregorio del Pilar-class frigates, the PN should be readying the crew that will be assigned to the ship. MaxDefense expects that South Korea will provide training to the initial PN crew. Instead of getting crew members from the Gregorio del Pilar-class frigates, MaxDefense suggests getting mixed crew members from the Rizal or Miguel Malvar-class ships plus those with experience from the Gregorio del Pilar-class frigates. They should all be provided with introductory training aboard the PN's frigates first before sending them to Korea. This could be done by using both the PF-15 and PF-16 simultaneously as training platforms for the next few months.


Aside from the ship crew, the PN must build up its maintenance and support base to maintain the ship's more complicated mechanical, electrical, sensors and weapons systems. MaxDefense expects the corvette to be more complicated than the US-made frigates, and this should be given attention by the PN.


Inside a Pohang-class corvette's bridge. This is probably from a Jinhae-subclass version and may have some differences with the older ASuW version.
Photo taken from namacha @ atwiki.jp


It is expected that the ship will need refurbishing and repair once it becomes available, its not new after all. It is a common practice for navies to stop refurbishing works once a ship is nearing its retirement date, even large organizations like the US Coast Guard does the same. The PN should already prepare the budget and start planning on the necessary works it needs to do with the ship based on previous/future inspections. It is not impossible that the ship may require some repair works as a precautionary measure before sailing on its own to its new home in the Philippines.

Aside from repairs, the PN should consider maximizing the use of the ship by upgrading it later on with better engineering, sensors, and weapons systems, and increasing its service lifespan. Not only is it needed to keep the ship in full readiness for several more years, but also to improve its capability as a front-line naval combatant, and in compliance of DND's rules on acquiring used assets.


The ROKN installed MANPADS launchers on later versions of the Pohang-class, several years after commissioning them. The PN could consider to do the same to improve the ship's defenses as the ASuW versions are not expected to have these. The photo above is from a later mdoel of an actual Pohang-class ship, used to mount a single Mistral or Chiron missile system.


For the PN high command, the approval of such transfer from South Korea should be followed with aggressiveness to get more. As more Incheon-class frigates come into service with the ROKN, they are expected to release more Pohang and Ulsan-class ships soon. These used but still capable Korean warships would be the best solution for the PN to immediately upgrade its fleet as a short to medium term solution, and this could only be attained if the PN can fight and lobby for government support to request the South Korean government to allow more transfers either as grants, donations, or priority sale. So far, MaxDefense can confirm that DND is in talks with South Korea's MoD not only for more corvettes, but other assets as well. Let's see the outcome of these talks and hopefully more good new will come in the next few months.

Of course there will be trade-offs on such request, and it may include our military's preference to acquire new military equipment from South Korea. It is to be noted that the AFP is in full-swing to acquire several weapons systems that South Korea is able to provide. MaxDefense does not see anything wrong with giving the South Koreans more access to our defense market as they have competitive defense products, for as long as these meet the AFP's operational requirements and price is reasonable and competitive.

It is expected that this deal would be discussed for some time until the ship actually arrives on Philippine shores. MaxDefense will provide more information regarding this deal later on.


218 comments:

  1. Even if we get the earlier versions of the Pohang (w/ the MM-38s), it will still be a quantum leap in capability for the PN as they have yet to operate a ship with AShM tech...and it could be a good transition ship before getting the 2 new frigates.

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  2. Do you ever see the prospect of the Philippines getting the Incheon class Frigate or going to the Ulsan class Frigate with modifications to included a helipad. I would think getting the Ulsan class Frigate would give them a perfect introduction to Multi Role Frigate operations.

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    1. No news on bidding other than the bids and awards committee allowing India's Garden Reach and France's STX to submit proposals for stage 2 bid. But with this and possibly the approval of other requests may do some tricks for a Korean win on the frigate project. The offers from Hyundai and Daewoo seems to be the frontrunners.

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    2. hopefully it's incheon class batch II with downgrade weaponry that meets PN requirment because this ship has bigger hull so we can upgrade more more weapons and system in the future and it's stealthy not like unlike ulsan class it's not stealth design hull

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    3. But I really doubt that for around $210M a pop we can get a down graded batch II. It would be nice but I just doubt that the Koreans can deliver that price.Navantia may cuz they are desperate or Garden Reach with its low labor cost (but can they deliver on time?).

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    4. We don't know yet what's in store. Its actually difficult to make a comment, although the Batch 1 has a more realistic chance of meeting the requirement.

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    5. I'll say this if the Philippines wanted to build a creditable Navy, they need to take a page from South American Navies such as the Chilean Navy. The build a Navy around a Frigate force with GP, ASW and ASUW frigates. Follow by Corvettes, OPVs and patrol boats. They need to follow that up with LPD's.

      Getting the Pohang class Corvettes will give the Philippines the Corvette capability and will bring them up to the Navies of the 80's.

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  3. so sir max your saying the PN will refurbished this before sailing to philippines? it will go to SLEP process like they do in planes?

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    1. Not SLEP, probably some repair works just enough to safely sail back to the PH. Normal procedures. It would probably be a hot transfer so its still ready to use as it is. Further refurbishing and probably even upgrades can be done later on.

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    2. Here we ago again getting 2nd hand ship as counter trade. There is no such free in the business world. Why not wait for the new light frigate acquisition and as part of counter trade is to develop our shipyard in the naval sea systems command. Remember a decommissioned vessel has an outdated capability which is obsolete and non reaponsive. If there is a counter trade develop first our facility and human resource. We don't have enough resources to maintain second hand ship. Even the two WHEC our country purchased to the US if without FMS case from US we cannot even maintain the system. Let us be practical to think where our resources be put thay it can create jobs not second hand platform that it gives haeadaches. I have been there in the Philippine Navy organization and the reality is that we have a limitrd resources. Be practical. Why not the money put on the development as part of counter trade agreement which is part of the procurement act law. I

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    3. The Pohang class corvette to be donated is not yet decommed...it is still currently active with the Sokor Navy. The PN has been operating 2nd hand ships for most of its history, one more would not be that much of a burden. Developing local ships is good long term plan but does not solve PN's short term problems of getting enough hulls in the water. The same rationale was used in the acquisition of the WHECs.

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    4. Really have you been in the support organization of the Navy, IHow things are being done. My suggestion is to develop training capability of the shipyard and.maintenance facility. The Whec with adfitional of one is still.necessary but to have pohang class with outdated system is a big headaches. I hope you havr been in the support organization of the navy and you can see the reality. We have upcoming two acquisition.of.new.vesses. we.have.two JVPV operayional, two.whecs.and.PCE to.patrol just to.show.our present in.our territory. Did you work.formerly.in the.navy?

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    5. Are you familiar with the systems on board a Pohang-class vessel? Who's to say that PN maintenance capabilities will not be upgraded upon acquisition of new units? Pls. cite particular Pohang systems and sub-systems that will give PN difficulties in maintenance vis-a-vis with current naval assets.

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    6. If the timeline is December 2014 this will only give the opportunity for the vessel crew on how to operate. The missile, torpedo and sonar and sensor system of the Pohang class even the combat management system and fire control system we cannot maintain if there is no proper training from the manufacturer. To tell you the truth the US SME for the WHEC system still our crew is relying on them in the maintenance on intermediate and depot level maintenance of 76mm guns and the FCS. This is reality because in reality at this moment our facility to take such intermediate and depot level.maintenance of the Pohang system unless ay this point in time we will now screen those ET with experience and send them to korean and the maufacturer for extensive training vis-a-vis our navy's labotatory. I did not tell in my comment that the navy will not upgrade but I have suggested that to put emphasis first on development of our personnel and facility prior acquisition.

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    7. There are no indications that proper training will not be provided. DND DSOM principles dictate at least a min 15-year sustainability even for 'donated' EDA equipment. It will be prudent to wait for additional details on the purported donation for any ILS and training package before any judgement on the merits of acquiring the said vessel is made.

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    8. My point here is to assess the prons and cons. I know that 5 of the pillars of the.Military strategy is human resource development and facility development. Don't you know that maintaining a different system is not responsive specifically on the implication of logistics sustainance support and integration of the system in the.command.and.control wherein.you have an.obsolete system.integrating.later into.new combat management.system to new command.and.control. we have limited resources. The.laksamanna corvette combat system of the.malaysia.where.being stripped due to obsolescence.issue.and non responsive missile, torpedo.and.sensors these are reasons the malaysian.government is decided upgrade of the four.platform because their.plan.to acquire two new FREMM frigate will be delayed. Also, the old combat system of the laksamanna corvette is a 1980's technology. The TWG for.DASAT must assess the prons and cons just like the procedure made formerly in the plan acquisition of maestrale.frigate. It was assessed properly the prons and cons. Our objective today is to have a mere presence of our platform in the WPS as part of MDA. Aside from that.when you.move as a task taskforce to have a credible deterrence it must have an updated system.

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    9. The point is proper assessment of Pohang's suitability to PN conditions has been/will be made in accordance to DSOM principles which has been institutionalized in the DND procurement program. All indications point to the PCC-758 as the vessel to be transferred to PN. Since PCC-758 belongs to the Pohang flight 2 sub-class, it does not have the Signaal PHS-32 sonar and torps for ASW (no maintenance problems there). The FCS on the PCC-758 is the Signaal WM-28 which is compatible with the BRP del Pilar & Alcaraz's Mk92 FCS as the latter is a USN licensed version of the former. The PN has also operated both the gun systems on the Pohangs (Oto Melara 76mm and Emerlec 30mm). The MM-38s are ARH missiles and can be replaced later on with Harpoons if the Harps become PN standard without replacement of the FCS as both MM38s and Harps require only seed coords for the INS from the SSR. Also the reported transfer by October or December this year does not indicated the actual transfer to PN after all training and refurbs has been made. With the case of the Alcaraz, it was formally transferred to PN on May 2012 but arrived in Manila following refit and training on August 2013. There are also indications (though unconfirmed) that this single unit transfer could also be a hands-on evaluation of the entire class for acquisition of additional units to finally replace PN's WW2 corvette fleet (Malvar and Rizal classes).

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  4. this is very humiliating. for a brief instance, we were more powerful militarily than SK. now, they're sending us their scrap. we better donate rajah humabon now to timor-leste so we can salvage some pinoy pride!

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    1. I'm sure it would be very humiliating for haughty fools that only care about "Filipino pride". I say we should accept the generosity of our South Koreans allies. They were our brothers in arms in the Korean War against the N. Koreans and Chinese. This contribution is something the S. Koreans still remember.

      http://www.philstar.com/headlines/2014/06/05/1331429/seoul-donate-corvette-warship-phl-navy

      Kim said South Korea’s gesture is “a small token” compared with the contribution of Filipino soldiers during the Korean War.

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    2. quite frankly, i don't see what's wrong with them giving us that particular Pohang-class ship. it would be a nice training platform for crews to finally transition into effectively utilizing tech only seen in guided missile armed ships.

      beggars can't be choosers. set the damn pride aside and be thankful, at least.

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    3. I just cant see the humiliating part you are trying to point out....if i may say...S.Korea could just be saying you got my back when i was facing the red menace now that the red menace has it's eyes on you I GOT YOUR BACK...

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    4. What the heck is our pride!!! Swallowed it up!! and start accepting donations.. Malaking tulong na yan sa ating Navy.

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    5. Pilipino pride will always be there in our hearts. But humility is more important especially at this time of our needs. We need more friends and we need more assets. Be positive, let's support our AFP.

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    6. Exactly, Kabayan Neil Villarnte. South Korea is our friend and ally.

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  5. This POHANG class was succeeded by the very modern frigate INCHEON class, if South Korea wins the bidding for 2 brand new frigates offering variations of the INCHEON with complete weapon systems for the Philippine navy , experience in the POHANG will mean a very smooth and fast transition for the Philippine Navy. The FA50 is brand new and based on the F-16 which are numerous and very available but the the philippine air force did not pick, some of the reasons are high maintenance cost and high airframe flight hours limiting service life. In an emergency, experience in the FA-50 will also mean a fast transition to the F-16 which again are numerous and was recently even given free to Indonesia.

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    1. Transition training platform we have already the two whec. There is no need to get second hand platform which will add additional cost for maintenance. Let us be practical.we have limited resoources.

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    2. the thing is, the WHECs given to us don't have the more advanced sensors and weaponry the Pohangs have. so yes, it is being practical.

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    3. Even you have a pohang class if the system.is still.obsolete in operational doctrine you cannot have a good doctrines to use because is out of context. The.whec has a very limited anti surface capability that is the reason we used them as mobile platform for maritime domain awareness. And maintaining obsolete missile, mines and torpedo without a ready human resource and facility materiel for the maintenance vis-a-vis witg safety of the system. I hope you will read what had happened to indian navy accidents on their platform because their personnel and facility is not ready it cost them death of their sailors and destroyed platform.

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    4. I think u are missing the point. The responses of ur comments point to one thing. Pohang is more advance than WHEC, its armaments may not be that modern weaponry but we need at least a taste of it before ful blown modern weaponry. Transition is the term. Wyl u maybe right that human resource & technical know how is indispensable in evry upgrading, it is diferent to hav them now something similar or nearer to what we dreamed of to have in our inventory. Besides we badly need floating assets as of "yesterdays"...having them & continuing learning from them are not incompatible, they can & they must go hand in hand

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    5. Really, are you sure the PHP18B pesos is for MRF that is your reason to have the Pohang as a transition platform. The PHP18B money for the project is good for OPV and not stealth corvette design with minimum deterrent. If we really care to have up to date training of the personnel for corvette why not that money for pohang retroffiting and refurbishing will be used for the personnel training like the concept of bringing the personnel to a latest platform corvette for extensive training. We have a limited resources, why not negotiate to bring in the personnel
      In South Korea for proper training in ship's handling, and proper operational and tactical to include on logistical aspect of the latest technology so that such doctrines to make is in parallel to latest threat in naval warfare. Remember we had a 5 Pillars in military strategy to have a modern platform vis-a-vis with personnel training, facility development, up to date doctrines in parallel to present and future threats. We are not talking only here in platform perse but the overall picture.

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  6. I hope that this donation will notmake our senators/congressman to reduce the allocated budget for the navy in the future, i mean some of them might think oh there we go we already have a capable warship lets redirect the funds to other project most of our politicians doesn`t understand/realize the importance of having a credible defense force, of course this is just my opinion......

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    1. The problem of the budget is not in the politician..there is enough budget but the high rank officer in the navy is worse than the politician when it comes to graft and corrupt practices..

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    2. I have heard of that. They just relaxed because of Pnoy's program of tuwid n daan, & media's exposē...

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  7. The Koreans seems to be very keen in winning the contracts for the new frigates. We don't see similar gestures from countries of other competitors. If ever any of the SK firms win the contract, let's hope one of the conditions are the ships will be built in their Philippine shipyards.

    I also think the government should be aggressive in reserving additional Pohang class ships to be transferred in the future. The sooner we can build up our navy to a respectable level, the better.

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    1. i agree. the Pohangs may be a bit old, but they're far more capable than any surface combatant we have to date. acquiring them should be prioritized so our navy can at least, be capable once again.

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    2. "let's hope one of the conditions are the ships will be built in their Philippine shipyards"

      the only problem is none of the 3 Korean bidders (Hyundai, Daewoo, and STX Korea) has a shipyard in the Philippines. Hanjin owns a shipyard in Subic, but did not submit a bid.

      In theory, if one of Korean companies wins the bid, they could subcontract the work out to Hanjin. But that would mean additional negotiations between the winning bidder, Hanjin, and the Philippine government, and might drive up the cost of the ships.

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  8. I've noticed that the frontrunners of naval power of today have this trend of arming their respective fleets with a combination of destroyers, frigates, and submarines (although the others are scrapping the frigates from their lists). I think its time for us to make a prospect of same setup and materialize it perhaps on beyond 2030. I think there's something significant with that formula together with supporting classes of naval assets at hand.

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  9. sir max if all the whec is fully upgraded like improving system and weapons like putting weapons adding more sensors will it be a full pledge frigate and will be part of PN desire force mix the 6 AAW frigate.or it will just an OPV? like 2 bidding frigate. and this corvette pohang cass become also if its upgrades is done? 12 corvette ASW thanks or it will be like jacinto class that's only OPV.please explain to me im confuse

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  10. Another miles stone for the navy. Congratulations. Sir max what do think. There is another pohang class coming in the future like the whec.

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  11. This is good news for PN, a big boost for our defense capabilities. Unlike the Hamilton class, this ship is more potent. Iam sure this is a token of appreciation not only during Korean War, but because we purchase defense items from Korea (FA 50). I just hope they will continue to support us. And I hope this may also trigger another help from our allies to give us more modern ships. But we should not stop there, continue modernizing our AFP. Focus and continue the 15 years modernization with our own initiatives and not relying on donations.

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  12. Some of the best analysis I have read hope someone pay attention

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  13. Why retirement Pohang Corvette ~ ~!
    Cracks in the hull pohanggeup rough waves!
    Budgets Pohang balance problems. Balanced input alignment concrete.
    Upgraded in 2005.

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    1. That's why we expect the PN to do refurbishing and repair works to the ship, to extend the service life.

      Delete
    2. How much is the cost of refurbishing and repair works? If that cost put it for the upgrade of the two whec the better. We have already two whecs a training ship. To operate an obsolete ASW and ASuW using missiles and torpedo with sonar is like we are having outdated operation doctrines.which is not responsive to the current threat. I think we have to assess tye prons.and cons. Even our facility and human resource is not ready ti.maintain.given the timeline.

      Delete
    3. And yet anonymous, The government is sending our troops abroad to train and be ready for such equipment's and operations. The US is also helping us through the Joint Agreement.

      Delete
    4. Ok, but what is the level of the training being done? Operational and organizational. Are you employed in the navy organization specifically on support side in the naval sea systems.command. yes I knowbthe navy has sent one ET and one officer to be trained in support.maintenance of the whec. My point here is to assess the pros and cons just like what they have done in.maestrale.

      Delete
    5. I know we were sending people there but is limited because we will be trained by the users on operational and organizational. But do you think sending only one ET and one officer for organizational.maintenance and we don't have a ready facility is enough. I guest if you have been working in the support organization of the navy than ypu will know. I know US is helping us because there is an FMS case fund that where we can get the support. How about Pohang class is same concept with US FMS case support if this is the case I don't question it. Second, we are operating obsolete system wherein same case with Maestrale frigate is a 1980's technology unless before tge transfer have to be refurbished, upgraded and the main engine and auxillary engine back to zero maintenance/ overhauled. They decommissioned because tgey knew the ship is not responsive to current threat and the cost of maintenance is high together with obsolete misdile, torpedo, sonar, CMS, FCS and ancillary system/equipment.

      Delete
  14. $ 240 million purchase two frigates difficult FFX-1.
    You must think inflation.
    Armed sensor downgrade.
    Battleship your world price ~ ~!

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Hi Young Oh, should the FFX-1 design wins, it is expected that there would be changes on the systems to keep with the cost. Example is the RAM missile system, it can be taken out and replaced with the specified type. Past discussions on this were made here on MaxDefense, you could refer to these discussions:

      maxdefense.blogspot.com/2013/12/updates-on-philippine-navys-frigate.html

      maxdefense.blogspot.com/2013/10/philippine-navy-frigate-acquisition.html

      Delete
  15. GMA betrayed the Philippines and other presidents previously for Selfish gain. If you had so much Filipino pride your would not let corruption be so prevailant. Thing is change is happening and again Philippines can be a proud nation.

    ReplyDelete
  16. Being Stealthy is the latest technology that gives a fighter jet or warship that added advantage over its enemy. Better for the Phil. government to buy the S. Korean Incheon Class frigates with the stealthy capability. And maybe, S. Korea might consider donating 2 instead of just 1 Pohang Class Corvettes as a bonus gift hehehe…

    ReplyDelete
  17. sir max,

    many thanks for this great article!

    also, hope you dont mind if i ask you to compare this pohang-class frigate to those we are getting new. how much better is one over the other? its just another gauge at how we are going on AFP modernization.

    regards.

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  18. sir max i have very important question if binay will be the president of the philippines will afp modernization will stop? like arroyo and erap.they done nothing in afp.now look at the damage we are one of the weakest in our region or binay will continue afp modernization because of the pressure of china or binay will just give the claim to china i ask this because i think binay will win the president election in 2016 i know the next phase of modernization is 2017-2022 so he will approve it.it's up with him if we can continue it.i hope all Pnoy effort will not be trash.what is your opinion sir max?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. just hope Binay doesn't end up sitting on the presidential seat. i don't like the guy at all. something about him stinks.

      Delete
  19. if every OFW 5 Million will donate at least 200 USD to theGovt to add to their defense budgets than it will help to acquire more asset,It is possible d to do this as long the govt will collect 200 USD as tax mandatory for tis purpose it will help.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. excuse me, are you an OFW? pls spare us from your suggestion that we donate 200 us dollars to defense budget. ano ka sinuswete? congress approved the revised modernization law with budget in it.if u feel the budget is not enough trabaho yan nang senador at congressmaen mag hanap nang pera hindi kami bilang OFW. salamat!

      Delete
    2. That proposal is unfair to the OFWs. It is the government's responsibility to efficiently earn to pay for the nation's defense and keeping sovereignty intact.

      Delete
    3. Really unfair Sir Max, imagine a Domestic helper earning 15k a month Philippine money is to donate 200 us dollars or around 9k pesos! whoever this guy is i think belong to corrupt politicians in our country. seeing that government has invested in external defense that requires a lot of money and those corrupt minded are finding ways and one way is by getting at us OFW.

      Delete
    4. A better proposal is to sell to our OFW's government bonds for defense acquisition. Instead of the big banks benefiting from government bonds at 5% p.a. minimum, it will be our bagong bayanis who will earn the higher interest income. Banks now give only 1% p.a.

      Delete
    5. Again why target the OFWs? do you think we have so much wealth working abroad to the extent you are promoting us OFWs as a partner in defense spending when in fact anyone who has descent salary can buy government bonds including yours. we already have our own share of contribution to the country's economy. like i said it is the responsibility of the senators and congressmen to find ways and fund our defense needs.

      renbios

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    6. You don't need any OFW donation. PDAF is GONE! It should be re-aligned and add to our existing AFP Modernisation Budget. And besides, PDAF is really utterly useless. Lawmakers are there to create/enhance existing laws NOT AS "PROJECT-MAKERS".

      Delete
  20. F35 to PH? Any thoughts sir max?

    http://manilalivewire.com/china-called-on-lockheed-martin-ceo-to-halt-philippines-f-35-jet-fighter-procurement/#sthash.uVaAzLrm.dpbs

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Sometimes, we have to think harder to know reality from a hoax. First of, his manilalivewire website is full of hoax. Secondly, do you really think the PH government ordered F-35s?

      Delete
    2. seriously. stop relying on internet articles that don't have valid sources. we, getting F-35s? yeah, right.

      i'd believe it a bit if it was a squadron of F-16s or even F-15s, but F-35s? when pigs fly.

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  21. I have a question, do we really dont have the money to upgrade our military or it is just that we dont allocate that much of it on Defense Projects, i mean for godsake we are a $300 billion economy, smaller nations with smaller income do have a much stronger military than ours....

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Well Philippines is only spending 1.2% of its GDP for its Military. That's around $ 2.9 Billion(2012) a year. The Government should consider increasing it. US 4.4, china 2.1, Russia 4.4.

      Delete
    2. Allen, there are plans to increase defense spending to at least 1.5% of GDP. Currently its still less than 0.8% including the yearly AFP Modernization budget 'till 2017.

      Delete
    3. In as much as they want to increase defense spending but the government hands is tied down by the constituion. Education must received the biggest share from the governments budget and they cant go beyond it unless they will amend the constitution. Perhaps the only legally permissible way to circumvent it is if the President will set aside portions of his discretionay funds and reallocate to special modernization project separate from the one provided by Congress by virtue of the modernization law. Though legally allowed, the Presidents discretionary funds nowadays are focus on DSWD and other social projects with DSWD alone getting a Php 40 billion boost for its 4 P's program (Popularly known as palimos program lol) on tap of the Congressional allocation for DSWD. Pnoy priority is social project not defense although in fairness to him at least under his administration his doing something about the AFP modernization. But if the Philippines is serious enough to modernize, Presidential discretionary funds may be used on tap of Congressional budget for AFP modernization. If we rely on Congress too much, it would be turtle pace modernization.

      Delete
  22. Good day, Could these hardware transfer from S.Korea affect big ticket items under bidding? If for instance korean firms does not win the bidding, will this transfer will push-thru... or could these transfer serves as leverage for korean firms to be favored in choosing bidding winners?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. this is my question too..but more or less push-thru pa rin yung donation pero it's like a lubricant i think na panigan natin ang korean firms okay naman din ang incheon frigate para sakin

      Delete
    2. honestly, i'm all in for acquiring defense-related military hardware from SK. those Incheons would serve our purposes quite well.

      Delete
  23. We should be thankful kahit second hand na barko ito malaking bagay ito sa Phil. Navy..atleast its as modern as it gets. And sana baka pwede natin gayahin yun ginagawa ng South Korea, we should now start to promote the indeginous production of our own military assets (patrol vessels...etc), not only are gonna save money but stimulate our economy as well

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I agree. The late President of South Korea who caused the POHANG CORVETTE to be produced, PRESIDENT PARK CHUNG HEE, sets a good example for us Filipinos. It was his purpose that SOUTH KOREA would be "self sufficient" in building military and naval equipment. He encouraged Hyundai, Daewoo, Samsung etc. PHILIPPINES has to follow the SOUTH KOREANS path and build the equipment in the PHILIPPINES. How hard would it be for the PHILIPPINE Navy to hire our talented Filipino engineers and naval architects, build a DRY DOCK on MANILA BAY, or SUBIC BAY, or CEBU, or DAVAO, get the engineering plans for the WHEC and /or the POHANG CORVETTE and start build an up dated version. In the future deal to acquire the two INCHEON COASTAL FRIGATES, one of them should be built under license in the PHILIPPINES.

      Delete
    2. ang problema lang talaga natin is budget wala tayong sapat na fund para sa iniisip mo at matagal yan.pero kahit matagal yan eventually makaka catch up parin tayo sa ibang bansa so budget lang talaga na allocated meron naman tayo budget kung tutuusin wala lang talaga tayong politcal will para magawa yung mga ganyan.

      Delete
    3. Meron tayo funds sir, us of this time iba lang priority ng mga politicians natin sa funds natin..abala silang nagpapayaman sa pera ng bayan..

      Delete
    4. meron po tayong funds, iba lang po priority ng mga politicians natin!

      Delete
    5. The problems is not just the funds, We have limited Defense Companies and Limited resources and technologies. We lack also designers, Designers who are good in building Warships not merchant Ships. Out of 10 students who gradually take the Marine Engineering Course, Only 1 or 2 Graduates with less experience in building. They end up being assistants in Big Ship building companies. Heck, I knew few who works as a Wielder rather than a Designer.

      Delete
  24. This are the types of warships we need - immediate availability, low-cost, well armed. If the Navy is capable, they can even transfer some of the main weapons to other ships to spread the threat level they present, and minimize catastrophic neutralization of firepower if this corvette is hit.

    More Pohangs, D'Estienne d'Orves, Descubiertas, Saars, Minervas, Grishas, Cassiopeas please. Up to 30 of them.

    Good News!

    ReplyDelete
  25. The INCHEON COASTAL FRIGATE is the perfect ship for the PHILIPPINE NAVY because of the full range of NAVAL WEAPONS it has, including CRUISE MISSILES. These can strike the COMMUNIST CHINA PLAN NAVY BASE on HAINAN ISLAND.

    ReplyDelete
  26. Ow so the topic that we're discussing last year starting to materialize, I hope we get the ship before the year ends and I hope again that we see who get frigate deal, anti-submarine heli, the shore-based missile, seaplanes, maritime patrol aircraft and the AAV.

    **cross fingers* *

    ReplyDelete
  27. A perfect name for BRP Colonel Dionisio Ojeda OF THE 10TH BCT in korean war ,a respect for the fighting filipinos in the korean war and a strong message to CHINA ...

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Good idea. The South Koreans respect that PEFTOK of the PHILIPPINE ARMY helped them stop COMMUNIST CHINA invasion.

      Delete
    2. that name is use by BRP Dionisio Ojeda (PG-117) Tomas Batillo class fast attack craft of the Philippine Navy.so i think we can't name it that name.

      Delete
    3. Why not name it BRP Datu Lapu-Lapu, I've never heard of Datu Lapu-Lapu been used in our Ships. Lapu-Lapu has been underrated by many people, For in fact we should be giving him honors for he is the first one to fend off foreign individuals from colonizing us and this time, it will be a first that we will be defending our country by means of our capability.

      Delete
  28. let say brp alcaraz and this pohang class corvette will square off pohang will pulvorize this US donated brp alcaraz.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. this is true because of sensors and weapons that will no strip unlike brp alcaraz it's like a gun boat with a big hull but when brp alcaraz is upgrade like adding missle,weapons,system and sensors.brp alcaraz can fight and should win because of the bigger hull

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  29. Since this pohang corvettes will be transfer to phil goverment and per specification this corvettes are using the LM2500 gas turbine and Diesel is there a possibity that PN would consider the Oliver Hazard Perry which also using the LM2500 gas turbine???

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Problem with the OHP is that it has a COGAG (Combined Gas and Gas) propulsion system, which means it runs only on its gas turbine engines. Unlike the Pohangs and the WHECs (CODOG - Combined Diesel or Gas) which can switch to the more economical diesel engines when cruising. USN OHPs also had their Mk.13 launchers removed, and with much of the ship's firepower.

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    2. no it's not economical just browse this site you can see all information why it's not good because it's only power by gas turbine so it's high maintenance and gas eater unlike Whecs from us. its engine is CODOG this pohang

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    3. add to that the rather... oddball placement of the OHP's 76mm gun. but honestly, we can get better value from CODOG-equipped ships. COGAG-equipped shops are gonna be too expensive to operate, since they're known gas-guzzlers.

      Delete
  30. I've read about this transfer more than 2 years ago, when the Koreans were still pushing the F/A 50s. The recent ship transfers are probably part of the package for winning the contract.

    We can probably expect another wave of transfers if and when the Koreans wins the Frigate contracts. Probably another Pohang class or a few KT-1s.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. The announcement on 2011 was a "leaked" information of negotiations being made between the PH and SK governments that time, although the Korean government did not commit to provide them immediately, but at a certain time when the ships are ready for transfer. There are negotiations to acquire more Pohangs as explained in the blog.

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  31. Hi Max,

    If defense spending is raised to 1.5 % of GDP, with current GDP at 300 Billion and doubling every 6-7 years (with projections of being a trillion dollar economy by 2030)..

    this means a defense budget of 4.5 Billion dollars every year, doubling every 6-7 years..

    Do you think our defense planners foresee a future where we maybe acquiring aegis destroyers and f35s in the 10 to 15 year horizon?

    Given that aegis destroyers are at 1B a piece and f35s at 160M, even though expensive, it seems like its something we can afford on a defense budget that may reach a 9B/year level in the next 7 to 10 years. What do you think?

    Regards,
    Dan

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Hi Dan, realistically speaking, I don't see the PN having Aegis in the next 20 years. Most realistic is for the PN to have more frigates and probably submarines in its fleet, and new fighters but probably not F-35.

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    2. Hi Dan, It is not impossible to acquire the Aegis System. You see Dan Aegis is not just the Ship itself. It is a combination of multiple platforms from The Destroyer, The Missile, and of course the land base radar stations that monitors the movements of the missiles which is fired based on the Aegis System. It is a very much complex system and I don't think that the Navy can transcend that much easily to the System. Currently the Japanese Navy has just been testing their version of the Aegis System. It takes years to practice such complex System, but don't worry nothing is impossible if the next presidents are Patriotic enough to continue the modernizations.

      Regards to you

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    3. I want to add to this a bit. Only a small portion of the defense budget can be used to buy new systems. Most of them goes to personnel, operations and maintenance. When I say personnel, I don't mean just their salary, but also their training, their health-care, and basically everything that involves a person. Operations includes rations, water supply, fuel supply, ammunition, etc. Maintenance is self-explanatory.

      Between all those, for most countries there's only about a quarter to a third of the defense budget left to spend on new weapon systems. In some cases it can be as bad as 10%. I'm not sure what the situation in the AFP these days, but Aegis destroyers and F-35s are not realistic and is probably unwise.

      Generally it's better to have a good number of decent systems that can be spread out to cover more area instead of just one or two top-of-the-line systems. Also, the Philippines is big.

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    4. Sir Max is right, PN needs more ships and probably submarines. We are one of those littoral nations that does not have submarine capability. For F-35, I think it is really possible for our Air-force to acquire it. But cost wise, DND is eyeing on the Grippen NG.

      Delete
    5. Thanks for your comments guys, Max. Masarap lang din talaga mangarap for the Philippines. I do hope that pinoys choose their future leaders wisely.

      Actually the basis for my question is given a scenario where our economy grows at 6%/year ( na hindi naman mahirap because were averaging 5% for a decade now), and our current population growth rate .. in 20 years our economy would be close to the size of korea and per capita income close to Malaysia.. all we have to do is not suck..

      With these numbers, we would have a similarly sized defense budget as korea, but man power cost at only 50% of what korea is paying its soldiers - meaning more funds for acquisition.. that's what made me think that whatever korea has now - we maybe able to afford in 20 years time..

      Cheers,
      Dan

      Delete
    6. While everythibg goes up, so does the amount to maintain the armed forces. If $2 billion is enough now to maintain the AFP, maintaining the same size could reach higher in the next few years. This is because of inflation. Its like buying a candy for Php 0.25 a piece 15 years ago, the same is Php 2.00 now.

      Delete
    7. I do agree, but still we have to wait that our economy will sustain its momentum vis-a-vis with military upgrade. It seems in my analyzation that we are going to the concept of planning than acquiring obsolete platform because such PHP18B pesos for two new platforms with stealthy designed is like the budget is enough for OPV or small corvette size. In my market research a platform of 2,400 displacement stealth designvwhich is derive from 3,000 displacement stealthy proven designed is almost PHP7/platform without the combat systems. So is like there are negotiation in transferring a second hand platform just like the concept of formerly the plan to acquire the maestrale but because of higher refurbishing cost the government has opted to new platform. And now we are getting second hand platform. We don't even have enough ET to be trained for the system if the transfer will done immediately even our facility is not ready. The question do we have money or tge South korean government will give us loan for this purpose. There is no such thing as free in the defense industry such transfer there would ve a corresponding cost. The question hiw much is the cost? If we really have to negotiate why not send our troops for training and upgrade first our facility. Is like that you have to acquire a car without a talyer and garage. Let us weigh the positive and negative?

      Delete
    8. This comment has been removed by the author.

      Delete
  32. Honestly PN should take a page out of Vietnam and invest in mobile coastal anti-ship missiles like the P-800 or even the Brahmos from India, this would serve as the greatest deterrence to PLAN and would make them think twice moving their valued naval assets to the region.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. There is a procurement program for that, and it may not need bidding. The project has started to roll and we may hear a lot of it in the coming months.

      Delete
    2. G to G? Israel, US and France system? Or combination?

      Delete
  33. This corvette + the 3rd WHEC in the works = more hulls for the PN. I can't wait for July because we'll finally know who the winning bidder will be. We need at least 2-3 ships per class. I hope we can get other ships like the Minervas, Descubiertas, etc to boost our capabilities. Waiting 3 years just for 2 frigates isn't justifiable enough for me, granted, they will be the most capable for the PN, but still... Max, if we get the ships by 2017, are they ready for immediate use, or do they still have to undergo sea trials?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. If we get the ships by 2017, sea trials would have been finished by then. This is because they are conducted by the winning bidder before delivery.

      Delete
  34. Korea's Next Weapon retirement!

    kdx-3 2040. armed ballistic missile interceptors (SM-3) upgrade
    kdx-2 2030 combat system, radar, long life upgrade (2016)
    kdx-1 2020 Upgrade x ---> kddx replacement
    Chamsuri Patrol (75 units) ----> PKX-A, PKX-B replacement 2018
    LST gojunbong (4 units) ---> LST-II cheonwangbong 2018 Replacement
    Ulsan frigates---> Incheon II 2018
    Pohang Corvette---> ncheon I 2018 replacement
    U-209(2015 Combat System Upgrade)----> 2024 DSME 3000ton AIP submarine replacement

    MIM-23 Hawk missiles (24 batteries) ---> km-sam 2016
    k-200 APC (2400 units) ---> K-21 (IFV), Rotem kw1 6x6 (AFV) 2018 Replacement
    UH-1H (140 units) ---> 2018 SURION replacement
    Kowloon k136 170 units (rocket launcher vehicle) ----- 2018 KMLRS replacement

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Are u a Korean or just a site name? What is ur source for the above info??...tnx

      Delete
    2. http://bemil.chosun.com/
      South Korea's largest military site.

      Delete
  35. Nice info. Do you know the unit cost of the Surions?
    I believe the AFP will increasingly be interested in the Surions as they mature.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. surion price -----> $ 17,500,000
      If the price goes down for mass production

      Police ----> 12 units
      Coast Guard ---> 12 units
      ASW --->?
      Marines -> 40 units
      Army ---> 220 units + @
      Medical transportation ---> 10 units

      Delete
  36. Has anyone not considered Singapore? Singaporean will be more than happy to gift many of their stuff to the Philippines if only the Pinoy friends are willingly to accept the friendship and treat them as partners.

    Look Singapore Navy will soon retire their Fearless class PVs, their Challenger class SSKs. Good opportunities to get lots of new-ish modern-ish platform on the cheap with training to boot. But alas, the Pinoy friends always look at Singapore as a little brother. Why would they bother to acquire stuff from Singapore huh.

    ReplyDelete
  37. goodluck to Philippine navy...im pretty sure the incheon class will win in the bidding.. but im not sure if when? July 2014? its impossible...

    ReplyDelete
  38. Hi sir max..is their news regarding the purchase of israeli radar?

    ReplyDelete
  39. Sir Max I would like to ask your opinion

    The PN wanted 6 anti-air warfare (AAW) frigates. The only way to have a capable platform is to outsource western systems. Do you think the government is willing to pay for a frigate (6 of them!) armed with the Aegis system, the PAAMS, or the APAR? Or would they settle on a lower generation of systems (apparently that's what's happening now)? Which among the 3 AAW systems would best suit the PN?

    Paul

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. 1 Aegis 1 year operating and maintenance costs $ 34 million (korea standard)
      Aegis of money is needed.
      Aegis of Life (AMDR alternative)
      Aegis now need to create a $ 150 million (inflation)

      Delete
    2. 2005 Baseline 7.1 SPY1-D ---> (U.S., Japan, South Korea joint purchasing)   110million

      2014 Baseline 7.1 ---> $ 150 million

      2014 AMDR ---------> $ 240 million

      Australia Hobart Destroyer --- $ 250million (problem with)

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    3. All the above would be way too advanced and way too costly for your navy. The french Marine Nationale for example originally wanted 4 Horizon-class destroyers (PAAMS), but finally settled on 2 due to cost reasons. Note that France has an annual defence budget that revolves around $50 billion.

      Delete
    4. If PN requires air defense against high volume attacks it has to have either one of the three systems mentioned (Aegis with SPY-1F/K radar and ESSM and or Standard Missiles, PAAMS with either SAMPSON or EMPAR radars and Aster 15/30 missiles, and the APAR also with ESSM and Standard). Choice of ESSM (for commonality with US) will require SPY-1 or APAR as ESSM are SARH and requires constant illumination for MCG and terminal phases. Aster on the other hand are ARH and does not require constant illum and is autonomous up to terminal phase. All these systems are likely to be expensive and therefore beyond PNs budget. There are also other phased array solutions (ceafar, seapar (light ver. of APAR) etc...) but cost in comparison to SPY-1F/K might be similar. Another approach would be to use multiple non-phased array radars to achieve multiple target engagement (1 radar = 1 target). Similar to the Durand dela Penne AAW destroyers which has 6 radars for AAW/target illumination for its Aspide/Sea Sparrow and Standard SARH missiles.

      Delete
    5. It seems your analyzation in the last paragraph I don't agree technically a six radar AAW and targer illumination. I think you misconstrude the technical aspect. The two I think is used for navigational, surface search and limited air support and surveillace like helo.

      Delete
    6. No error. There are 4 other radars for Navigation, Air and Surface search. This is in addition to 6 FCS radars. 2 for the Standard missiles and 4 for the Aspide and 40mm guns.

      Delete
    7. Really, so therefore has more than.radar compared to.mestrale frigate. Maestrale.is using 3FCR, 1 Surface Surveillance Radar, 1 Air Surveillance, and 1 Navigational radar. So Pohang corvette base on your data technically there would be a problem on EMC/EMI during high alert.mission since you have so.many radars. What is your reference?

      Delete
    8. And dami.naman.ng navigational radars mo apat I think.maximum lang dalawa kasi kapag apat na navigational radar there something wrong. How many 30 mm does the pohang had? How many main gun? Usually 1 surface search radar and 1 air surveillnave radar. You know what is EMI/EMC effect when you have so many radar in the structure that will have transmission interference. The maestrale frigate has only 3 FCR, 1 ASR, 1 SSR and 1 Nav radar. I don't agree with your analyzation.in.Pohang radar. And what is your reference?

      Delete
    9. Ah guys, i am referring to the Durand dela Penne AAW Destroyers not the Pohang. I used it as an example of an AAW platform that predates phased array radar-equipped ships that can perform multiple air engagements using SARH missiles. The dela Penne has 6 FCS radars (2 AN/SPG-51s for the Standard missile and 4 Selex RTN-30X radars for the Aspide and cannon armaments). Nowhere did I say it was a Pohang class ship.

      Delete
    10. It all goes to this that if the PN really is requiring a very capable area air defense ship (w/c I strongly support) then it has to be either of the 3 systems mentioned above. I think the APAR along w/ the S1850 radar and standard missiles is enough for us. Another developing platform though is the air defense variant of the FREMM frigates called the FREDA that uses Sea Viper w/ aster family of missiles.

      Delete
  40. Off topic
    News on the PN's ASW Helo's:

    1st stage bidding moved to June 24 from June 3. Still 2 firms confirmed who bought bid documents, Bell Helicopters and AgustaWestland. It seems Sikorsky doesn't find the project profitable. Or maybe the MH-60R is just way over budget? Your thoughts on this?

    http://www.janes.com/article/38958/philippines-extends-deadline-for-asw-helicopter-bidding

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Korea Purchasing MH-60R 8 units ----> U.S. FMS ($ 125 million)
      AgustaWestland AW-159 20% discount ($ 62 million)
      SURION ASW participate in development
      Additional purchase options Korea AW-159 10 Units

      Philippines AW-159 2 units must be thinking $ 70 million.

      Delete
    2. How can AgustaWestland stay within the $60 million budget per unit? It wouldn't be able to unless, the Philippine Navy lowered the sensor and weapon system requirements.

      Delete
    3. It depends on the services and tech agreements with AW. If only for units, the amount allocated by the DND is more than enough. It is expected that the DND would only require ILS for a certain span of time, training, and ammo. No tech transfer agreements unlike those with Korea.

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    4. The South Korea did not buy the sikorsky mh60 romeo, rather 8 Augusta Wildcat Helicopters.

      Delete
    5. This would be the right time for PH to consider a technology transfer for some Augusta Westland helicopters like the AW 109 choppers. Since we acquire more platforms of these choppers we better suggest to AW for Tech Transfer and reactivate our govt owned aircraft industries like PADC. Mastering the technology of AW109 will allow us to sustain technical support in the long term and besides we can manufacture the aircraft locally to create jobs. Future AW109 platforms of the philippines will be built locally and it will be cheaper considering the labor cost of the philippines. The PN should opt for more AW109 EQUIPPED with FLIR and dipping sonar to maximize their surface and sub surface surveillance operations.

      Delete
  41. Hi Sir Max! Is there an update about the coast guard ships from Japan?

    ReplyDelete
  42. Hello Sir Max. My question maybe off topic but I just need ur reliable response. Q: Is it true that aside from the 8 CUH Helos from Bell Canada the govt has another contract from Augusta for another 8 AW attack helos that will go to the Air force?...Tnx for ur time always

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Yes...attack versions of what the navy got.

      Delete
    2. http://maxdefense.blogspot.com/2013/11/aw109e-power-accepted-as-pafs-next.html?m=1

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    3. Sir Max: Jst ur personal assessment. Do u think the DND-AFP wud stil go for KFIR after having FA50 in the invty?...coz I felt it's a vry gud MRF cost wise & the add on 40yrs warranty. Tnx

      Delete
  43. Philippine Navy is larger in order of time.
    In order to complete the 6frigates + 12Corvette need a 20year
    United States, Japan, Britain, France, Korea Navy needed time to complete 30year.
    Chinese navy to fight in order to write a budget gdp 2%.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. The PN is starting from scratch, unlike the more advanced navies that follow a standard schedule and number of assets. The British will be building new frigates to replace existing frigates and destroyers, while the PN has long been needing replacements for its decommissioned assets in the past, and increasing its force structure according to its new requirement. We'll see more projects coming in once the PN award the new frigate project soon.

      Delete
  44. Another wonderful blog post. Thank you very much for his very detailed explanation for this coming new asset for the PN. Mabuhay po kayo. :-)

    ReplyDelete
  45. http://www.adas.ph/trade-visitors/why-visit.html

    Asian Defense, Security and Crisis Management Exhibit and Conference. See you there on July 16-18, 2014 at World Trade Center, Manila.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Can ordinary citizen attend this event?

      Delete
  46. Thank you Max!
    My English is wrong.
    I hope you have a good discussion on the following

    ReplyDelete
  47. sir max..how sure is that final bidding of 2 frigates this July?

    ReplyDelete
  48. from usec manalo of dnd most likely by july 2014 a news will be announce who will bag the new pn frigates construction.

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  49. These are positive news for the maritime assets of the PN. Although I agree with Max that the PN should start or if it's an going long term commitment on their logistic and support plan in maintaining these assets . For instance The planned oyster base as a forward operating base for the WPS and the former Subic naval base and air station as a joint operating base for naval and air defense. I was in Subic bay last December and it seems that that the US has several naval ships moored along the port and one of them is the USS Cowpen and a supply replenishment ship. The naval air station was almost an empty air field except for some private companies. I hope they could include these sites as possible EDA bases since it's already in existence and the proximity of these bases to the "hotspots". The DND with its technical " advisers" should realize at this point that the US because of its precarious stand on the Spratly issues would be a de facto on their MDT . So , it would be on their best interest to consider other pipelines such as South Korea , Japan and Israel as a source of technical support. With that in mind they should consider the footsteps of Indonesia in acquiring those defense assets and at the same time being in a coop in productions of the said items. It's always in the best interest of a country to be able to be self reliant .

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  50. Max, just wondering, if the PN is to achieve its Desired Force Mix even as a minimum credible deterrent (that is, plus personnel to man its navy bases), how many more personnel would it need to enlist to add to its current number?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. They are currently having nationwide recruitment for seamen, electronics and computers specialists, those with knowledge in mechanical, electrical, ship building and design, and a lot of specialists. Even the NAG is requiring additional men.

      Delete
  51. http://www.news.com.au/national/australian-defence-force-to-sell-off-thousands-of-vehicles-and-other-war-equipment/story-fncynjr2-1226565344839

    Sir Max, Australia is selling huge number of military items.Do you think we will grab some?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. There might be a possibility since the PH government and DND has been monitoring this, as well as other "firesales" like those of Israel and Canada. Land vehicles may be a problem since AU trucks and light vehicles are right-hand drive, although armored vehicles may not be a problem. M113s will be available as well.

      Delete
    2. 70 F/A 18 Hornets, 110 other aircrafts, 120 helis, 600 APC's and etc.. That is huge. Hope Philippines could get a slice of the pie.

      Delete
  52. yah!! They have nationwide recruitment but they are not FAIR!!! they only give considerations whom they personally know.. those with out technical backgrounds has a higher passing rate compared to those who have technical backgrounds.. It is very annoying that the other candidate who got a lower grade than you will be accepted because he had a technical backgrounds.. and those with Padrino inside!! ganun ba talaga kailangan ng MBA? May Backer Ako!!... pinapaasa lang nila mga tao at tinatanggap para mag exam yung mga walang technical backgrounds pero hindi FAIR yung process!! dapat pantay!!!

    ReplyDelete
  53. .sir max, how about the assault rifle acquisitions?? any update??

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. First batch will arrive next month July 19....27,000 units.

      http://www.straitstimes.com/the-big-story/asia-report/philippines/story/philippine-army-gets-arms-upgrade-delivery-27000-m-4-rif

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  54. Hi sir Max,

    May news ka ba about sa delivery ng 10 hueys? Alam
    ko June yung delivery. On the way ba ba or ma
    move pa? At yung mga ibang delivery for our AFP?

    Salamat!

    ReplyDelete
  55. some of those items are long gone and probably whats left are junks.considering the sale was way back jan 2013 or even earlier

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. did you even read the damn article?

      Delete
    2. tama ka junk lang talaga yan..pero ok yan sa mga top rank officers ng PN kasi kikita sila dyan ng malaki sa repurbish nyan

      Delete
    3. oh god, you people just can't seem to shut up. red tape and political bullshit aside, just be thankful SK is willing to help us out here. puro kayo reklamo eh.

      Delete
  56. we support afp/dnd modernization..mga bugok at baboy kasi dati mga politiko natin!!!mga buwisit sa lipunan ung mga namumuno!!!

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. wag mo sisihin pollitiko kasi my budget ang afp natin kaso ang nakikinabang mga top rank officers lang mas gutum pa sapulitiko ang mga yan

      Delete
  57. this is not expected..

    http://defense-studies.blogspot.com/2014/06/philippines-interested-in-russian-bmp-3f.html

    ReplyDelete
  58. It seems that the DND is prioritizing the modernization of both PN and Air Force.. How about the Philippine Coast guard?i think its better to fast track the coast guard and it is badly needed to patrol the sabina and ayungin shoal with water cannon ability. Is their any news with our procurement in japan?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. The Coast Guard is not under the DND, but with the DOTC.

      Delete
    2. Coast needs is a super fast craft with speed of 60 knots in order to catch illegals or outrun china surveillance ship.

      Delete
  59. http://www.angmalaya.net/nation/2014/06/22/1229-philippines-interested-in-russian-bmp-3f-report

    is this true Sir Max?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I hope so, not only are they amphibious...they have nice firepower too. They also have a dozer, which would've been useful at clearing roads after Yolanda.

      Delete
    2. Well the BMP-3M has dozers. Not sure about the BMP-3F ones.

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  60. The coast guard and PNP are para military units. Its best to reorganize them under one department like a homeland defense and named internal safety and security department. The maritime section of the bfar can be integrated into the coast guard and have bfar people just ride along. That way use of resources will be more efficient.

    ReplyDelete
  61. .sir max about the refurbished hueys??

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Thanks for the reminder....I'll see what I can get from this deal.

      Delete
    2. Four of refurbished Huey's are already at Clark AB being assemble as part of partial delivery. It will be showed to the public on PAF day in July.

      Delete
  62. sir max latest update po sa lahat ng afp acquisition meron n po b?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. M4 rifles to be delivered partially by July, frigate decision by July, bidding for CAS aircraft by July, PAF AW109 pilots in Italy now, award to Elbit Systems of RCWS systems for APCs...actually there are a lot and MaxDefense doesnt have the chance to discuss all, but I'll try as much as I can.

      Delete
  63. in the ff. article I came upon the quoted paragraph:

    http://www.abs-cbnnews.com/nation/06/24/14/ph-japan-explore-collective-self-defense

    "In the face of the regional situation becoming increasingly severe, both nations are closely coordinating. I reaffirmed with President Aquino today the significance of the three principles of the rule of law, which I outlined at the Shangri-la dialogue and at the G7 meeting. I explained to the President about the approaches we are taking under the policy of proactive contribution to peace, namely the drawing up of the three principles for the transfer of defense equipment and the studies which are underway on relationship between the right of collective self-defense and the Constitution," he said.

    Sir Max, are you getting reports or even rumours of what these "defense articles" are? Aside from the 10 patrol boats for the PCG off course as i get the impression these will be second hand equipment.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. No accurate points yet as the deal is in the early stages. But defense articles that the PH is interested in right now are expected to be the ones the government may request from Japan, like aircraft, armored vehicles, non lethal equipment, and ships.

      Best if you can determine what the AFP needs first before we continue with this. I believe previous MaxDefense posts already made some headway on what the AFP needs and requires that it currently tries to get from other countries like the US, Israel, and Korea.

      Delete
  64. Let us put our thinking cap shall we ? A newer ASW version of this Pohang class corvette was the same type that was torpedoed and sunk by a miniature North Korean sub in 2010. The PLA subs could do much much better ! Look, the Spratly's are at most just a few hundred miles from PI mainlands and most of them are less than 10 square miles in area. These reefs are perfect for a cruise missile and anti-ship missile strike. I would think it would be better to be on the offensive on these reefs - there is simply no place for the enemy/PLA to dig in. Now, if you think about it - these proposed new frigates are ultimately a missile/ payload delivery platforms.The problem is it would take lots of effort and resources to defend them against PLA subs. I would think a better investment would be for the PI to acquire cruise and anti-ship missile and long-range radar technology . I would assume making these 10 feet or so land-based missiles would be much easier than building subs or frigates. And there are many countries such as Ukraine and Israel where we The PI could license and get technical help. You could sorround Palawan with these land-based missile batteries with the cost of one or two brand -new frigates. Don't get me wrong these frigates are still needed for coastal defense but the PI should put more effort on acquiring the ability to make land-based missiles and radars. Sir Max - what do you think?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Let's face it: Even if the PN have all the latest equipment out there, the Chinese can simply sink them when they want to. Do you think an Arleigh Burke can really escape from a determined Chinese attack? I think not. But why do we still try to get these ships, as old as they may be? This is where you must take more thinking...

      Subs are effective to kill other ships and subs, but they cannot do what ships can do. Land based anti-ship missile batteries can also kill ships with ease, but that's about it, they can't be used for other things. That's why defense is expensive, because you need to have several platforms available to suite different defense requirements and different threat matrices.

      Delete
    2. In simple analogy is a task force which is joint operational concept from the PN, Airforce and Army.

      Delete
  65. If successful bid frigate Incheon ...
    RAM, Phalanx-1B I give up?


    RAM Block 1 ---> $ 1.9 million
    Phalanx-1B ----> 1.2 million

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Hi Young Oh, there was a previous discussion of this in one of the older MaxDefense blog entry. IF (with emphasis) the Incheon-class gets chosen, it is expected that the RAM might be replaced by a simpler system like the Mistral or its Korean alternative from LIG Nex1, and thr Phalanx will be replaced by 2 Mk.38 Mod.2 guns or something similar. This reduces the cost while still within the ABC. The land attack missiles must go too.

      Delete
    2. The price of a Phalanx Block 1B and RAM system may exceed $10m combined if I'm not mistaken. So it could greatly reduce the pricing of the Incheon-class. Since it was designed to carry them, it would not be a problem if the PN decides to acquire them in the future under a separqte acquisition and budgeting program.

      Delete
  66. Radar Incheon frigate wrong.
    Not smart-s mk2.

    Incheon radar is an active phased array radar.
    Audience development.

    The main antenna array consisting of 24 elements assembly,
    Semiconductor transmission assembly 16, receiving assembly 08 of semiconductor,
    24 channel digital receiver for receiving
    Output: 2KW/MODULE, PEAK POWER: 32KW

    SMART-S MK2 peak power: 2kw x 12unit transceiver module = 24kw
    FFX radar peak power: 2kw x 16unit transceiver module = 32kw

    Dutch company Thales SMART-S MK2 license Cancel!
    LIG-NEX1 developed
    Wikipedia is not correct catalog

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Hi Young Oh, yes the Smart S was not used on the Incheon. I need to update older blog entries. The antenna looks the same but it was actually a radar system from LIG Nex1 that is different from Thales' Smart-S. I don't have the specs of this radar, anything you can share aside from the peak power?

      Delete
    2. FFX-1 RADER
      Detection distance up to 250km Based aircraft detection range up to 250km .
      100km cruise missile the size of the class 13.7 per minute during low speed rotation detection range of 250km
      27 per minute during high-speed rotation of the rotation detection range of 150km.

      Delete
    3. Air defense to give up? Oh my god ~!
      Mistral, Mk 38 Mod 2 25mm Machine Gun System
      None the defense frigate fighters
      Chiron VSHORAD canceled! (VLS missile haegung alternative)
      RAM should be the minimum equipment

      Delete
    4. Young Oh, it would be best if you could check the technical specifications of the incoming frigates on this blog entry:

      http://maxdefense.blogspot.com/2013/10/philippine-navy-frigate-acquisition.html?m=1

      http://maxdefense.blogspot.com/2013/12/updates-on-philippine-navys-frigate.html?m=1

      Delete
    5. In radar system you just not talking about Effective Radiated Power of the radar but how powerful its software algorithm vis-a-vis with coherent data gathering and analysis in.different miliyary environment. ERP in mathematical analogy is directly proportional to range. The latest technology is AESA with passive or active phase array. The terms are beam forming with multiple frequency during tracking, chirp, compressed pulse, doppler process, MTI process etc. As part of the radar system. I am a filipino a former naval officer.

      Delete
    6. FFX-1 RADER Engineer says
      Linear Array Active Phased Array Radar(S-band)
      FFX-3 DUAL BAND (S / X BAND) equipped
      GaAs mmic----------> GaN mmic
      High Power Amplifier mmic + Multi-chip transceiver mmic
      ---->X-band radar T / R module

      Radar semiconductor devices units

      SPY-1B:?
      SPY-1D 1 face : 4352unit -> 500km
      SPY-1F: 1856 unit
      APAR 1 face: The 800unit -> 70km
      Sampson: 2500unit -> 250km
      EMPAR: 2200unit
      SMART-L: fighter 400km


      Delete
    7. I saw your blog.
      Armed, ammunition, sensors downgrade .. + _ +
      3D search radar downgrade???
      PKX-A SPS-540K 3D surveillance radar ... right?

      Delete
  67. this comment is what separates a backyard analyst from those that studied, experienced and get paid for analyzing.

    you even attempt to shoot a PLA ship and you give the Chinese an excuse to sink every ship and planes the PLA fancies destroying.

    - buboy

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Vietnam has more capability to sink a Chinese ship, but why it didn't do so even if the Chinese already damaged more than 2 dozens of Vietnamese government ships and an oil rig sitting on their EEZ. Shooting a ship is a prelude to war. One must realize that China has the capability to wage a small to medium scale war with Vietnam, Philippines, or both at the same time.

      Delete
    2. i was commenting on --- > AnonymousJune 26, 2014 at 4:28 AM but it went to the main thread.

      exactly Max. too much computer games and simple-mindedness.

      in the short term, we need awareness (more hulls for presence and radar) more than warfighting. presence provide disputability to China's claim of "indisputability".

      for long-term stategic, the satellite is the way to go plus the deterrence armament gamers mentioned.

      the difference with Vietnam and PHL is that Vietnam is "isolated" politically. PHL enjoys a good standing in international relationship. That's why Vietnam's back is pushed against and they got more urgent needs to purchase actual strategic war materials like submarines and missiles.

      Don't get me wrong. We do need them, eventually. But in the thought process of URGENCY versus IMPORTANCE: Urgency wins hands down. And urgency in our context is "PRESENCE". To dispute the claims of China. NOT to overpower China.

      We got the UNCLOS on our side, friendly nations and the World is watching. Thus, we do have other cards to play.

      Vietnam doesnt.

      Delete
    3. Hey Buboy – Did I say Shoot the Damn PLA Navy ships in my previous comment ? You may want to reread it if you were not just too lazy
      Let’s look at the most likely scenario. The PLA decides to take the Spratly’s and they send a flotilla of 100 ships – as they did in Vietnam. Are we going to send our 6 or so frigates to deal with this threat ? That would be suicidal – the PLA guided missile cruisers alone- not to mention their subs – would blow our frigates out of the water before they even get within firing range. What I’m saying is that from a tactical and just as important – from a practical standpoint - the best way to deal with this scenario is through land-based as well as air-launched cruise/anti-ship missiles. Our only permanent advantage is that the Spratly’s are only a few hundred miles from our shores. We can scramble our fighters and launch our missiles within minutes.. Best of all if we can license and acquire the tech to build these missiles ourselves – we would have acquired transferrable technology to build the weapons of tomorrow – like drones for example..What the AFPis doing right now is to get where our neighbors were militarily about 20-40 years ago. Why can’t we skip a generation of military tech and go straight to tomorrow – similar to what some backward nations did in skipping landline phones and going straight to smart cell phones?

      BTW, whatever happened to the missile program that was started my Marcos ? Say anything you want about FM – but the man knew something about military matters. That program would have come in handy at the present situation.

      Delete
    4. To the “smart” UNCLOS guy - the time for the PN to project “presence” is way past. Just in case you did not notice – the Red Commies assumed effective control of the Spratly’s a few years back. Why don’t you try showing your brand-new hulls anywhere near those China Coast Guard ships circling the Spratlys and see what happens? God help the PI if those PN ships will do anything provocative if their new shiny hulls get rammed. The problem was that you kept electing those same thieves who emptied the national coffers The best flag-showing effort the PI could afford is to park a pathetic-looking rusted hull in one of those reefs. Try the same stunt with another one of those dilapidated WW2 PN ships today and see what happens.

      And if you believe a favorable UNCLOS ruling will save the PI - I would say you do not have a clue on what the PRC is all about . Most Pinoys have this belief that once they win the court ruling – those Chinese ships will magically go away never to return again. That of course is pure fantasy.
      The Chinese have little regard for Western- inspired legal theories. You should not blame them The Western powers themselves illegally occupied and divided China into several territories not too long ago. They think the UNCLOS was just a ploy for the Western powers to preserve the status quo. You can broadcast the UNCLOS ruling all you want and those Chinese ships still would not leave. After all who would act as the sheriff to enforce the ruling ? Aha – Uncle Sam you say ! .
      Let me tell you some facts – not accurate but you could google . US trade with China is approaching 1000 billion USD versus. a puny 25 billon USD or so with the PI. Do you think the US will risk losing that huge biz by going to war with China . ? US politicians are ultimately controlled by powerful corporate interests .The chance that the US will try to kick out China just so their little brown brothers would have their reefs back is almost nonexistent. When the US will try to broker a deal and ask the PI to give up some of those reefs to settle the dispute once and for all – Pinoys will better be ready to share the Spratly’s wit these Red Commies. As for the rest of the world being on our side – just google some stats. Most of the major nations – heck even the PI and its primary supplier South Korea depend on trade with China.

      Bottom line – the PRC will never leave the Spratlys until they get some or most of those reefs. . They believe time is on their side. The PRC will be the world’s biggest economy within a decade or so. They believe their bargaining power will only grow stronger as they go on to be the major player in the world economy.

      Delete
    5. To FVRs credit, grounding the Sierra Madre was a master stroke. A general's move. If the Chinese are trying to make us do a wrong move to justify using force, we should play our own game. Don't react but anticipate and deny. Any force applied by PLA to AFP will trigger the MDT. say what you will but the PLA are smart and they will keep applying the Salami strategy. IMHO, the Kennedy escalation response may ultimately be an option to the Salami. For the meantime, the Unclos may suffice. Don't underestimate the power of international opinion/sympathy. Korea, Iraq, Fukushima, Yolanda victims, Bali, Somalia, etc have benefited from positive international opinion/sympathy. Never enter a battle before it is won. China is moving because it thinks the battle is already won. We move not to meet it head on and lose but to chose battle we can win

      Delete
    6. There is no denying FVR's credential as an Army General. But if he indeed ordered the grounding of that rusted hull, I'm not sure if FVR understood some basic principles of property ownership. In order to establish ownership to land - you must occupy it. And in order to occupy it - you must build permanent structures on that land. Now argue that to the Red Commies - is this rusted hull a permanent structure ? The least FVR could have done is to build a permanent barracks for those poor marines to stay in. Or if that was too rich - a permanent concrete flagpole.
      By going the UNCLOS route - all the PH is going to do do is to accelerate the permanent PRC control of those reefs. These Red Commies will try to build structures as fast as they can on the anticipation that they will not be able to do so after a ruling against them. Do not be surprised if these pirates will try to tow away the Sierra Madre as the UNCLOS ruling deadline is approaching.
      IMHO, the best the PH could do is to acquire/build weapons capable of deterring these Red Commies. By going the UNCLOS route - the PH may have shortened the time frame to get those weapons.

      Delete
  68. sir max any news on bmp-3F?

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  69. sir max how about the upgrade of GDP class Frigates of PN what is the news??????

    ReplyDelete
  70. Simple analogy, a powerful nation has the might in terms of economic, diplomatic, politics and military. So like as a 3rd country we are in the mercy of the US always first their interest not ours.

    ReplyDelete
  71. Better hot transfer whatever hulls out there and put more presence. Prc is now surveying Benham Rise - esp. on look out for any shoals outcroppings so they can start planting their flag and claim it.

    ReplyDelete